Mary Joyce | Secret Bases, Little People, & Skyships Over Cashiers

Show Notes

Join Greg Carlwood of The Higherside Chats podcast as he hosts Mary Joyce. A long time journalist and author who has written several books including, “Cherokee Little People Were Real” and“Underground Military Bases Hidden in the North Carolina Mountains”, Mary is also editor of the website Skyships Over Cashiers, which among other things, details UFO activity in the area.
Many of us who have waded deep into the weird forest have inevitably come across stories of aliens, UFOs, and secret military bases in the southwestern United States. Whether it be crashed saucers in Roswell, secret underground other worldly battles at Dulce, or a doomsday safe haven for the elite underneath the Denver airport, the western frontier is ripe with weirdness. Digging into the archives of early America, there is plenty of evidence giants once walked these lands, and confirmation found throughout dozens and dozens of newspaper reports and Native American legends that state the same.
While many people have their spotlight shining on the New Mexico Desert, they’re missing all the sweet, similarly secretive stuff going on in the polar opposite of the country, the mountains of North Carolina. And while giants dominate the narrative of other ancient humanoids, the lesser discussed legends of the little people living throughout the Carolina hills continues to persist. Listen as Greg and Mary take a complete 180 to discuss the legends and lore that are prominent throughout this region.
2:20 Listen as Greg and Mary begin by giving some geographical context to the particular area under discussion. Mary details her initiation into the weird world of underground military bases, UFO, and giants and how this led to the creation of her website Skyships Over Cashiers.
3:25 Opening Pandora’s box, Greg and Mary begin by discussing the existence of underground military bases discretely scattered throughout the mountains of North Carolina. As Mary explains, of the 5 facilities studied in her book, The Smokey Mountain National Park is the most prominent and easily identifiable one. She also details the site within Mount Mitchell, the tallest mountain east of the Mississippi and the Pisgah Astronomical Research Institute, a facility remaining from the days of the Cold War.
6:15 As one of the largest underground facilities, Mount Mitchell is said to be it’s own self- sustaining habitat containing access to water and electricity and running up to 20 stories subterranean. With such an elaborate infrastructure in place, Mary elaborates on how this may give credence to the concept that Mount Mitchell is home to numerous UN troops. Listen as Mary explains that in 1972 under President Nixon, the US entered into the World Heritage Treaty, granting access of American lands to the UN and opening the floodgates for UN troop occupation.
13:30 Armed with a wealth of knowledge from former military associates, Mary catalogs the transportation of military equipment to these areas through aerial drops. Listen as Mary then details the extreme measures taken to discourage any type of investigation into the events in these areas, including but not limited to a “people repellent”.
16:20 After photographing several anomalous UFOs above the mountain range near PARI, Mary was compelled to document her findings, bringing about the birth of her site Skyships Over Cashiers. Listen as Mary identifies the numerous craft types she’s witnessed including the typical saucer, diamond shaped crafts, and oddly enough hovering boulders resembling volcanic rock. As the conversation continues, Mary and Greg discuss potential interactions with the pilots of these crafts, and whether their appearance in national parks in conjunction with growing list of disappearing people are related or simply just coincidence.
20:00 Greg and Mary continue down the path of weird by discussing her visit to the rolling mountains of Tennessee. Contacted by a man whose family lineage can be linked to the Euchee Indians and Ireland, Mary details the story of how his family fled their homeland and in their journey, brought with them little people who have resided on their family lands for centuries.
24:00 On the polar opposite end of the spectrum lay the giant. Listens as Greg and Mary discuss the history of giants, and the systemic efforts by academia to erase all proof of their existence.
31:20 Greg and Mary discuss the testimony of Hawk, a key witness to many Mount Mitchell anecdotes. A former Vietnam veteran and medic, he enlisted in the National Guard and was assigned surveillance duty. Listen as Mary details his eye witness account including the opening of the side of Mount Mitchell.
37:00 With the influx of military supplies heading into these mountains never to be seen again, Greg and Mary begin to speculate what the future holds. Listen as they discuss the circumstances for which the elite may be preparing, and the conditions currently being incubated throughout society that may lead them to exercise use of force.
41:00 Listen as Greg and Mary discuss what she refers to as the “blue moon”, or an object that has been photographed in the orbit of the sun.
45:00 Returning to the legends of the little people, Greg and Mary discuss the network of tunnels that runs beneath university grounds in Carolina. Accompanied by the discovery of small skeletons these tunnels built from red clay are presumed to those of the little people who inhabit the inner earth.
52:42 Listen as Greg and Mary discuss the history of the little people with the Cherokee. After migrating from the Great Lakes, the Cherokee were greeted by little people already occupying the area. Under the light of the moon, the legend states, little people with a blue tinted skin would emerge to tend to their gardens, collecting produce retreating back to within the mountains.
58:30 Greg and Mary examine Native American mysticism and occult practices. With their culture decimated by the white man, and most of the people marched through The Trail of Tears, Mary explains that the remnants of the Cherokee tribes in the southeast corner of the US are all but lost.
1:01:42 Listen as Greg and Mary discuss her work regarding a large mysterious petroglyph rock located in the land of the little people that predates the Cherokees known as the Judaculla Rock. Another example of an ancient artifact is “Lead Head”, which was unearthed after a flood in 1940 exposed the artifact that had carvings of what resemble a leprechaun.
1:10:42 Returning the the legends of giants and the Cherokee, Mary elaborates her research involving the Judaculla. Mary hypothesizes the mysterious Judaculla of the Native American legends may in fact be Bigfoot.
1:16:10 Listen as Mary describes her involvement in a Bigfoot gift exchange research project. While paused for now, Mary explains this type of research is best conducted during winter months when food supplies are more scarce. She also details interactions between local residents and Bigfoot habitats as well as the consequential aftermath.
1:24:32 Listen as Greg and Mary discuss the purpose of the Black Knight satellite. In an interesting turn of events, they discuss Tesla’s interaction with what he believed to be a transmitter from either Venus or Mars.
1:33:45 Check out Mary’s video about the the two kids in Roswell.
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46 Responses

  1. I super enjoyed this episode Greg. 5’s for everybody 🙂
    Mary does have a fresh story to tell and a really good tuber interview “two kids Roswell”
    also, “Inspired by Bigfoot” with Bill Lee, pod cast. I wonder if they can open dimensions with intention and tone? Kinda Magic!

    1. Thanks! I certainly thought it covered a few new things. I rarely hear about the NC area. It’s a little Coast to Coast-y though.

      I really think people are going to want me to get back into the deeper darkness of the conspiracy world, and I thought that’s what Leo was going to be when I booked him, but we’ll get back to that soon!

      1. From Greg ; “It’s a little Coast to Coast-y though”.
        Not at All!,… It’s a little Mary Joyce’y… and I loved all the topics
        It’s just that I live in the Big Foot “Zone” that the stories are interesting to me.
        Leo, not so much, but, I tried to like him. 🙂

  2. Wow.. I found the comment the guest made about how Reptilian’s like to eat small children (age of 2). the reason why I found this so interesting. This is because over the past 2 years (I am 40 now).. I have had to come to terms with my earliest childhood memory of a 7ft tall Reptilian staring at me in my window! It took me 36 years to put the pieces together because this is literally my earliest memory. Here is the route my thinking took.. and it gives you some of the back story.. I would be curious to hear if anyone else had such an experience while young.

    I remember that I was still sleeping in my “Crib”. I asked my Mom how old I would have been, and she said 2 or 3. Why do I trust this memory being that it was from so long ago? Well I don’t claim to be able to remember EVERYTHING from my early childhood, so why was this memory burnt into my consciousness? I came to the simple conclusion that this was real, otherwise I would have never remembered it.. Just like i never remembered any of the other mundane things from back then.

    So let me recap what happened. When I was 2, it was right before I was being put to bed. My parents were out of the room, and next to my crib was the one and only window. The window had blinds. So my memory of this is that for some reason I was compelled by something to pull the blinds. I’m not sure why.. I wouldn’t have seen anything except the dark black night because I grew up in a semi-rural area.

    Whatever it was that was telling me telepathically or influencing me to pull the blinds won over… and this timid 2 year old walked over to the wall, reached over to grab the blinds cord.. and I pulled it hard.. so that the blinds shot up fast (was scared.. I remember shivering with fear like you would when you convince yourself a monster is in the closet and you are scared to open it), and then I remember screaming my head off and be more scared then I had ever been in my life. I may have pissed myself.. I am not sure. But.. remember vividly a tall (roughly 7ft tall) green lizard man with yellow eyes staring back at me. I freaked, jumped from my crib and ran to my parents.. Yelling that , “Gill Man was in the window”. This is key, because I described what I saw the only way I knew how.. At the time I had “Super heroes sheets” and one of the characters was “Gill Man”.. anyone familiar with comics will know what i am talking about. After that though I have no memory.

    For the next 38 years of my life I pretty much filed away the traumatic experience and moved on in my life figuring that my eyes/mind were just playing tricks on me.. So I pretty much the only reason why I remember this occurrence is because it was so traumatic.. It literally scared the piss out of me.

    Now, fast forward to 2011… Like you, I was intrigued and found myself sitting through a number of David Icke videos on YouTube.. and then the Reptilian Eyes flip videos.. and then the light bulb went out. “Gill Man”.. I did a couple google searches and I was convinced.. I was visited by a 7ft Tall Reptilian when I was 2 or 3.. Not sure why he didn’t eat me.. but I have more questions now then I answers..

    Has anyone else had a similar experience? If so, curious if you are like me and have barely shown that you have aged? (For example, I am 40, but I still get carded for Cigs and look no older then 30). I have o+ blood type (not RH).. however, I do have an extremely high intelligence.. and resemble the Aryan look.

    So as you can imagine.. I am starting to think that I might be a part of some sort of hybrid program.. Because someone has been keeping me alive, or saving me from myself.. because I should be dead. Think about it like this… have you ever crossed the street and for some reason you instinctually jumped to the left or right.. and ended up avoiding being hit by car or bus.. without even seeing it come.. basically saving your own life..

    For some reason, my whole life has been filled with occurrences by this. On more then one occasion when I was a teenager I built a homemade firecracker with black powder. We use to do this for fun because I grew up in the midwest/north.. so in the winter we would blow holes in the ice with our own home made black powder firecrackers (because most our Dad’s had bullet re-loaders). One time I made a pretty large one.. (It was a half day at school, so my friends and I got home early).. Except I packed this one with nuts and bolts because I for some reason wanted to blow my own mailbox up.

    Anyways, I ran out of chemical fuse, and instead improvised with reused firecracker fuses. BAD IDEA! Short story, shorter.. The fuse went in 2 seconds.. I had just enough time to close the door of the mailbox.. but I was directly in front of it. I held my arm up to shield my face saving my eyes from being burnt (only ended up burning one of my corneas). The miracle though is.. I was in the direct line of fire of what basically turned into a giant cannon.. that should have blown a shot of nuts and bolts into my face and neck.

    I should be dead.. But not a single nut or bolt was found.. In the mailbox, or on the street after the incident. I managed to survive with 2nd degree burns on the left side of my face.. which now prevents me from growing a beard.. haha.. but yeah.. my point is.. someone, or something has been looking out for me I think.. There are some hints to this in my career track as well.. but I won’t get into that yet.

    I am the grandson of an Ancient Arabic Order of the Nobles of the Mystic Shrine, 32nd Degree… My guess is as good as yours.. I’m figure this all out as I go on.. but if anyone would like to discuss this more.. leave me a PM! I am dying to find someone who may share a similar story!

    Thanks for reading all this.. I know it sounds completely crazy.. but hey.. if I was looking for fame or hoax.. I sure as hell wouldn’t have used that story! Haha..


    1. BTW, sorry for the bad grammar up there in certain places.. I ran out of time with the edits.. So be nice!

      “and then the light bulb went out (in my head)” has to be my favorite.. especially right before I state that I score high on the intelligence scale! haha.. Well, at least I can laugh at myself! But man, what a crazy story! Can you believe that I am actually quite normal, and hold a steady software engineering job!?!?! Weird eh? You would assume I would be a complete mess. I can’t say any of this “Waking up” stuff has been easy.. When one goes on this journey.. you usually aren’t expecting to find yourself an actual “Subject” of the “Alien Hybrid” topic.. haha Oh well, I’m going to roll with it.. I would rather look like a fool discovering the truth, over looking real cool while self-imposing ignorance which now that I think about it.. is the “Status quo” being marketed to us EVERYDAY! Hmm coincidence? I THINK NOT! 😉 – John

      1. Hey,
        You might like to read this series of books. I think there are 8 in all, here’s the first…
        From Amazon
        Riding the Wave (The Wave Book 1) Paperback – April 4, 2007
        by Laura Knight-Jadczyk (Author)
        It’s an eye opener or shutter!

  3. Good show was nice not to hear about Hillary or Trump for a few hours… Im irish living in another country but i remember growing up with the tales of another place where great warriors lived sorry for the spelling i will try …tear na nough where they could run through the forest without breaking a twig anyone out there remember these stories

  4. The interview turned out better than expected…odd how she almost seemed annoyed at times.

    Gregg, if you’re currently not working in some writing field you are seriously wasting the talent you have with language. Do magazine work, blogging, opinion pieces, short stories, fiction, non-fiction, anything but just wright. You’re a classic wordsmith. It’s obviously a natural talent for you…be a shame to see it go to waste. And it could be a nice little supplemental income….you know, till you find a real job.

    Only one thing….Xspecially? …really?…come on, you know better.

    1. I like Greg just where he is. Let us enjoy his witty words. He’s got a free YouTube channel, so even non-member csn join.
      I AM WORTHY of hearing our Dear Word Master speak. Are you not ?

    2. I thought I was the only one to notice that…and it’s jibe with not jive with fyi. But I try to be more polite :). But Greg is one of the best intro men ever. His guest intros are damn near poetry. Just needs a little fine tuning!

  5. -Super job, as usual! I agree with webbyjk’s observation that Mary did seem annoyed with Greg’s questioning at times. OTOH — Maybe it was just her own frustration with not having the solid proof Greg was asking about, or maybe it had nothing at all to do with the interview. Regardless, I think she’s a credible individual and I appreciate her research very much. Thank you to both Greg and Mary!

  6. Great episode! Really great questions. I’m glad you brought up David Politis, wish you would have brought up Donald Marshall. I know he sounds crazy and full of shit, but it freaks me out how well his story fits with so many researchers’ info.

      1. Well, I meant irt the missing ppl. He says the elite hang out with reptilians that look like dinosaurs at secret bases in remote areas and kidnap ppl for nefarious purposes, including eating them; it fits in with Mary’s “little people” and the missing 411 stuff somewhat I guess.

      2. Moreover, I really enjoy and find compelling the subject of underground military bases and tunnels. When one realizes the US and Russia have had nuclear powered tunneling machines that rapidly melt their way through rock sense the 1950’s, it becomes inescapable that the US and Europe are crisscrossed with tunnels.

  7. I found two very interesting points:

    1. Draconians – In 1994, Alex Collier did a 2 hour interview (now on youtube). In it he claimed to have been in touch with blue skinned Aliens from the Andromeda Galaxy. He was told that Draconians living under the surface were supplied with children by the Greys. The children were scared and then eaten so they could get high. I laughed when I first heard it but now . . .

    2. Urantia book mentions 6 sanjik races : The blue race was the most advanced but is now largely extinct except in white people and a few others.
    I have found very little info about blue people and was intrigued about her remark of a tiny blue race.

    Great show, as usual.

  8. Ooh! Fabulous! There was a ton of info in this and I’ll certainly be checking out the links. The bit that really got my attention was the stuff about the little people. I’m from an old Irish family and some of us have an ongoing relationship with some of the littl’uns and the Sidhe (these are also called the shining ones and are more like Tolkien’s elves). My aunts would talk about hearing the banshee (from ‘bean sidhe’) and they were usually right about who’d just died. My dad used to tell me about seeing and hearing the little folk dancing in the hills at full moon and I always thought he was making it up…I’m not so sure now.
    The thing with the Sidhe is that if they like you they look after you (and you look after them and their land; after all they’re pretty much family) and if they don’t like you, watch out. The Bell Witch events and Amityville look like pissed off faeries to me rather than ‘demons’. They’re not human and they can be utterly ruthless.
    Incidentally I now live about 3 miles away from the place where Tolkien once lived. I sometimes think they had a hand in getting me to live here because I certainly didn’t want to. I eventually came to love it here and of course I always make sure to leave out food for them and milk at full moon.
    I haven’t seen them – I tend to experience it either through feeling their presence or dreams or occasional anomalous events (e.g. apports). I always know when they’re about and sing to them or read them poetry, which they love. No accounting for tastes I guess. I’ve learned that they are a tribal people, there are several types. Some are friendly and some really don’t like humanity. Looking at what we’ve done to their homeland who can blame them?
    I know this sounds bizarre. I’m quite sane, honest!

  9. Interesting show. I just cant believe there are no real photos and/or videos with bigfoots or little people. As Crrow says – “we live in an age when anything that can be filmed will be filmed in HD” and we still don`t have photographic evidence?! Really? She and other people know where they live and just dont care enough? Oh we have photos of footprints!!! Big deal! Oh, we saw where the little people danced – wow, amazing…. nooot. We spent our money two times sending sh*t to lab, but we did not buy bunch of game cameras and try to get a photo instead? Really? What a load of BS.

    Loved the host though 😀 !

    1. I have no trouble believing that both the big and little people could have a sense of how to not be imaged with our technological devices, while we, the thinking apes, have a bit of trouble keeping future and past imaginings from completely occupying our front-and-center awareness. Perhaps our big and little counterparts, arguably having an equally high intelligence, and very possibly a more developed psychic and/or intuitive consciousness, manage to have their awarenesses remain present, keeping them easily one step ahead of smart old us.

    2. Dzhon have some respect wouldja? These creatures are magic and you mighta lost what little magic you had. They smell arrogance on the wind and don’t get suckered by tourists with cameras.

      1. Magic. How convenient :)) ..

        BTW, I did not say that I think little people or bigfoot do not exist, I just said that it is very strange to me that there are no photos after all these years.

        1. I have had experiences with our northwestern crows that have shown me that beyond their known high intelligence, a seeming psychic ability is there as well. The corvids (crow family) in general have a brain to body weight ratio that is nearly equal to humans.

          So, these other highly evolved primates might have a psychic intelligence baseline that is only rivaled by our stand-out, publicly known, human psychics. Such highly evolved psychic intelligence could easily be construed as ‘magic’ by those of us relying only on our physical senses and rational logic. Once again, we think we are so smart, and yet, there are mysteries standing there with nearly everything we see, hear, and feel, making shows like THC a requirement.

        2. “very strange to me that there are no photos after all these years.”

          Photography has been around for how many years? Humans have been talking about these things that exist in the corners of our vision basically for ever. Most people can’t even see them square on, so how in the world would they catch them on camera, let alone if they would even show up on the medium the camera is capturing images on.
          We are the cats in the library. They, quite possibly, are the Professors with multiple Doctorates.
          And they still are not the ones that actually built and stocked the library…….

          Magic is just science, (or actuality) that is too advanced to wrap your head around, yet. To paraphrase that old dude.

          1. Speaking of Crow/s, when is he back on the air Greg? GW on crows in next episode – fantastic. As an ex-pat historian, can GW give us the meaning and source of that Aussie expression of incredulity “Stone the crows”. I understand that there are lost ancient roman texts on augury and omens, and a whole treatise on reading crows for ‘signs and wonders’. I will have to find that reference in old notes. PS Dzhon, sorry if I was rude, but per above comments – magic is so much bigger than us humans, so we just gotta roll with that, and sure, camera roll too if we can. I just reckon mystery animals are too quick and know us too well. Reminds me of that Bad Brains song about how you gotta have ‘the quickness’ in this world. Thanks THCers and GC

  10. I really enjoyed this one. Have friends and family down in NC and was just down there last weekend. Need to ask them if they’ve ever heard any of these stories out at Western Carolina.

  11. I enjoyed the show but I also take some issue with the forensics or DNA lab she is sending her samples to. She said she sent in some animal scat she found believing it may be Bigfoot but came back as grey fox. The issue is is that a grey fox is only slightly bigger than a house cat and Bigfoot is supposed to be 7-9ft tall and massively muscular. I don’t see how you could possibly mix the two up. I would think there would be quite a bit of difference in size of feces there. Maybe they are just telling her it is something mundane like a grey fox to appease her and they are still able to collect the cash for the test.

  12. The World Heritage Site discussion rang personally to me. Currently there are seven sites in Ohio (one a couple miles from me) that are jointly being considered as World Heritage Sites. All three sites are considered to be Ancient Ohio Earthworks by the built Hopewell People or as they are sometimes known the Mound Builders. They are speculated to have lived in the area between 100BC to 500AD. Nothing usual here except the amount of land being offered is over 100 hectares and the scale of the earthworks suggests technology that should not have existed at the time. Or Giants.

  13. Pretty interesting show. She is absolutely right about the military elite building mansions high on the mountains, I’ve seen up close, one that had 12 ft thick perimeter walls. I vacation in the western NC mountains about every other year, specifically Asheville. The area harbors a very powerful (negative, dark) energy for sure. My guess is the elite chose this area for experimentation and military activities based on the pre-existing energy, kind of similar to the location outside of Geneva chosen for CERN is known for many oddities. Tour the Biltmore mansion with a discerning eye/spirit and you will pick up on this immediately, probably on an important ley line.

  14. Wow! Where to start! Y’all are talking about my back yard. I’ve lived in this region for most of my life so I have a few points to add to this conversation.
    I went to high school not far from the PARI facility and as I recall, rumor said it was either a CIA or NSA “listening station”. It is open to the public today for astronomical observation occationally.
    The wealthy elite have deep roots in this region going back at least to the late 19th century, namely people like George Vanderbilt (Biltmore Estates), DuPont (paper mills) and Hearst(newpapers). All of Pisgah National Forest was donated by Vanderbuilt and more recenty Dupont gave a large chunk of land making “Dupont State Park” which is close to PARI.
    I believe the Blue Ridge Parkway is an important part connecting this system of underground bases. If you look at a map the Blueridge parkway starts just south of DC and ends in north Georgia, connecting all the areas that Mary Joyce mentioned. The Greenbriar Hotel is/was a part of this system too, but was “closed” when an article revealed it as the US Congress nuclear bunker. The National archives where stored here during WWII in case DC got bombed. Essentially I believe this is where the government will go when SHTF.
    Not to mention that this area is a rich water source, and water is/will be the oil of the 21st century, so securing that might be a high priority?
    Great show glad to hear others experience on things I have come across over the years.
    PS. I’ve heard Obama has bought property in the area?

  15. Some interesting info but I could not manage to listen all the way through because she sounded so irritated. And GC is the most respectful and thoughtful interviewer ever. All I can figure out is that she must have been tired or in a bad mood before the interview started.

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